ROB SCHMITZ, HOST:
This is ALL THINGS CONSIDERED from NPR News. I'm Rob Schmitz. Weeks after more than 70,000 people crossed the Moroccan border into the Spanish territory of Ceuta on the North African coast, the Spanish government says that most of those who crossed the border are back in Morocco. But reporting from NPR shows thousands of migrants, many of them unaccompanied minors, remain in Ceuta, while the local population remains leery of their presence, and that means tensions have not resolved. On Saturday, Reuters reported that Moroccan police arrested more than 100 people as they tried to enter Ceuta.
Now, as both sides tighten security on the border, there are still many unanswered questions about why this massive crossing of people happened in the first place. Maria Munoz Morillo believes she has some of the answers. She's the Spain bureau chief for Euronews, and she recently wrote a piece titled "Ceuta Explained: How Spain's Biggest Migration Crisis Unfolded." I spoke to her earlier this week, and I asked what people in Ceuta are feeling.
MARIA MUNOZ MORILLO: Well, things are still very tricky because after 15 days, we had this avalanche in Ceuta. There are still a lot of people there - according to official figures, between 5,000 and 10,000 illegal migrants still in Ceuta. Around 2,000 of them are minors, which is very tricky because...
SCHMITZ: Wow.
MORILLO: ...They cannot be returned into Morocco.
SCHMITZ: So this was a shocking event. I mean, what do we know about what prompted these tens of thousands of people to suddenly cross from Morocco into Ceuta?
MORILLO: So it's not the first time this happens. This had happened before in Ceuta in 2021. There was 10,000 people crossing by. At the moment, Spanish government had the suspicion that Morocco used those people because we had in Spain in the hospital - it was during COVID pandemic - Ghali, who is the Polisarion (ph) Sahara leader. So it's not the first time. Apparently, Morocco uses people, civilians to put pressure to punish Spain. This time, at the beginning, the government, Spanish and the Moroccan one, they were saying it was due to human trafficking networks, but a few hours after that, they started to look into social media. And they realized there were messages saying the border is open, go to Spain, you will have papers, you will have housing, you will be able to move around Europe, so just go to Spain.
SCHMITZ: You mentioned Morocco's involvement in this mass sudden migration. What evidence do we have that Morocco's government was involved?
MORILLO: We don't have any evidence apart from what intelligence services are saying. They actually say they alerted the government, but the home minister denied all these accusations. Actually, the government is backing up Morocco. They are saying, we are working with Morocco. Morocco is an ally.
SCHMITZ: Just to be clear.
MORILLO: They are helping.
SCHMITZ: Just to be clear, Maria, you're talking about the Spanish government.
MORILLO: Yes.
SCHMITZ: Yes. OK, got it.
MORILLO: The Spanish government - it's, let's say, cooperating with Morocco and Morocco is cooperating with the Spanish government. But sources from intelligence, from Guardia Civil, from our police officers, they say that there is a plan, and it is a pattern. It is not the first time we see a country using civilians, using immigration against our country to put pressure. Actually, the government from Morocco, the justice minister, a couple of days ago in an interview, he said that they want to talk about the sovereignty of Ceuta and Melilla. Both of them are in Africa. Both of them are enclaves. They've always been Spanish for the last centuries. They've never been Moroccans.
They are not hiding anything. They want to talk about this. Actually, the U.S. Capitol - maybe we should start talking about Ceuta and Melilla being in Moroccan territory, being Moroccan nationalities. The Spanish government has been very serious about this. The defense minister yesterday, she was very clear - Margarita Robles. She said Ceuta and Melilla are Spanish. They've been Spanish for centuries, and they will stay as Spanish autonomous cities.
SCHMITZ: Did you just say that the U.S. Capitol, that U.S. Congress was talking about this?
MORILLO: Yeah. The situation is hard for Spanish government because we all know the feud between Trump and Sanchez. They are not friends. The relationship, the diplomatic relationship is not at a great moment. Morocco is an ally to the U.S. At the moment, it makes sense that the U.S., they may back up Morocco instead of Spain because Spain right now is not a friend of the United States.
SCHMITZ: You know, I'm curious - what are just normal people on the street there in Spain saying about this? How do they feel about this issue?
MORILLO: Morocco is the one calling the shots. Like, we don't understand why the government is more critical with the country that made this happen because the reports we got from there that day, the 31 of July, is that the Moroccan forces, they weren't doing anything. Actually, The New York Times published that some of the officers were telling the immigrants, yes, you just need to feel that way, and you will enter Spain. So we wonder why the country and the European Union is not more critical with a regime that it is using the citizens to put pressure on another country.
SCHMITZ: That is journalist Maria Munoz Morillo of Euronews. Thank you.
MORILLO: Thank you very much. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
NPR transcripts are created on a rush deadline by an NPR contractor. This text may not be in its final form and may be updated or revised in the future. Accuracy and availability may vary. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.
